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Old 10-16-2011, 06:57 PM
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Default Joinery Saw

Taking a break from cutting what seems like an endless procession of dovetails, I decided to make a joinery saw. This has been on my list of saws to make for a while. It compliments the carcase saw I built recently. There is a family resemblance in the designs of the two saws.

The plan was for a 9" long plate with 1 1/2" of cutting area and 16 ppi crosscut. The carcase saw is essentially a larger version, with a 14" long plate, 2 1/4" cutting area and 14 ppi crosscut.

The joinery plate is also a slimmer 0.018" thick.

The build was not uneventful. Don't you hate it when this happens ...



That was Padauk, from a chunk that was a Christmas present. It was always a borderline choice as it felt soft and brittle. Then I was not careful enough when chiseling the mortices for the screws. Live and learn ...

In the end I used the same Jarrah board that I had for the carcase saw.

Here is the joinery saw (apologies for the pictures which do not do justice to the grain) ...









Thanks for looking.

Regards from Perth

Derek
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Old 10-16-2011, 08:23 PM
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Default Re: Joinery Saw

What a delightful little saw, Derek. Beautiful work.
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Old 10-17-2011, 07:41 AM
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Default Re: Joinery Saw

Both saws look fantastic. Too bad about the "event", but in the end, everything worked out!

Perhaps a silly question, but where did you get the saw plate?
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Old 10-17-2011, 07:58 AM
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Default Re: Joinery Saw

Hi Paul

I get my saw plates and brass backs from Mike Wenzloff (Wenzloff & Sons).

Regards from Perth

Derek
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Old 10-17-2011, 09:39 AM
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Default Re: Joinery Saw

Beautiful saws, Derek. The handles look comfortable and I especially like how you "layered" the closed part of the carcass saw's handle.
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Old 10-17-2011, 02:59 PM
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Default Re: Joinery Saw

Very nice indeed!

I like the "hump" that fits into the palm that Wensloff shapes into their Disston model 77 saws.


Last edited by RONWEN; 10-19-2011 at 12:57 PM.
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Old 10-17-2011, 03:43 PM
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Default Re: Joinery Saw

Klaus (Two Lawyers Toolworks) asked me a question anout the handles of these saws ..


Hi Derek,
... One thing: the rear line of both of the grips is nearly straight. Maybe you feel that to be comfortable. Then all is good. Perhaps you should try to make a handle in your own shape which has a hump at the rear side of the grip just to compare the comfort. I'm pretty sure that you' d like the different feeling.
Regards
Klaus

Klaus' question reminded me of the one of the design features of the saws, something that I have failed to emphasize, and one which I would enjoy hearing comments about.

What I have here for handles is something a little different from those (with the "hump") that I have made in the past. I suspect that others, such as Andrew Lunn (ex-Eccentric Toolworks), have done similar, although their reasoning may be different from mine (and perhaps it is the same ...?).

Here is one of Andrew's dovetail saws ...



My aim is to not only have a comfortable handle, but also to create a controlled grip. The comfort comes from sizing the handle to my palm, and including enough of a "bump" to fit into the palm. It is there but disguised by the second factor, which goes to control.

The second feature is that the handle is triangulated. That is, it is thicker at the base. What this does is support the underside of the hand, and lift it up, where it snuggles into the underside of the horn. The underside of the horn is where I believe the control lies.

Here is a picture of Ernest Joyce using a tenon saw. Note how he uses his thumb on the upper horn to lighten the weight on the saw ...



A while back Chris Schwarz posted something similar. In his case he used the lower horns to do the same thing.

Link: http://lostartpress.wordpress.com/20...my-lower-horn/

That's my theory anyway. I do find the saws very comfortable to use.

Regards from Perth

Derek
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Old 10-20-2011, 04:51 AM
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Default Re: Joinery Saw

I've played with Derek's (and Chris's) techniques a bit and I do like how the saw feels & responds at the start of the cut.

Chris Schwarz wrote: "Whenever I teach someone to saw, I plead with them to apply no downward pressure as they begin the kerf. I ask them to pretend that their saw is a hovercraft and to allow it to float gently for a couple stokes as the teeth slip gently into the work, parting the wood fibers with care.
Jamming the teeth into the work will get you nowhere. In fact, usually you will get stuck because the teeth will divot the work. Then as you push forward, the teeth wont slice; instead they will jump forward from divot to divot. But if you take all the weight off the saw, the teeth will slice cleanly.
And here is where your lower horn comes in. If you can feel the lower horn pressing hard into your palm then all the weight is off the toothline. So relax your hand, hold the saw with little or no grip and let the weight of the saws tote drop onto your middle finger. The lower horn will start to push into your palm. When it is pressing firmly, then move the saw backward and forward."
(Chris Schwarz demonstration picture)


I don't have a handle as straight (humpless) in the palm area as Derek's saw but I was still able to get the "hover" effect that Chris Schwarz suggests -- pretty cool!
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