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  #101 (permalink)  
Old 04-18-2011, 01:27 AM
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Default Re: Something Wicked This Way Comes....

You know your shop layout but maybe rather than a wall you'll want to mount it to a 360 degree jib crane or column out in the center of the floor where it can service more area? Time Saving 360 Degree Jib Crane and other Jib Cranes are available at A Plus Warehouse
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  #102 (permalink)  
Old 04-18-2011, 02:19 AM
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Default Re: Something Wicked This Way Comes....

I have given the placement a lot of thought. That particular corner is the optimal location. Remember, it has a 16-foot sweep (32-foot diameter), not counting the length of the vac hose on the end.

That corner will serve 95% of the assembly room (100% of the usable portion), and if I mount it below the beam, even a significant portion of the machine-room can be reached, which isn't really required. Mounting it in the other corner on the opposite end of the beam would reduce the coverage of the main assembly area in the shop (it would barely reach the wall of shame).

The only location that would improve coverage would be mounting it directly in the middle of the beam, which is a main traffic area.

Another consideration is keeping it out of the way when not being used. This location is pretty good for that. The only location that would be better would be turning it 90 degrees and mounting it below/adjacent to the beam. This way it could fold up against the wall above the lathe. The reason I dismissed this is the added complexity of mounting it with the beam pocket right where it would need to mount.

The solid lines represent the actual sweep of the boom. The dashed arcs are another 6' from this, representing the reach of a standard hose. To give you perspective on size, the angled room is the garage with two 8-foot doors.



Oh, BTW, Festool does have other brackets for mounting this from the ceiling or a post (360 deg rotation). I didn't need them, so didn't request them.
Attached Thumbnails
something-wicked-way-comes-floor-layout-sw2011.jpg  

Last edited by RickChristopherson; 04-18-2011 at 02:23 AM.
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  #103 (permalink)  
Old 04-19-2011, 02:34 PM
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Default Re: Something Wicked This Way Comes....

Another possibility would be to weld a vertical steel member, like heavy-wall box tubing, to the bottom of the steel beam, extending to the floor and bracketed to the concrete wall in two locations. You could probably hang a Smart Car from it without moving the structure.
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  #104 (permalink)  
Old 05-14-2011, 10:01 PM
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Default Re: Something Wicked This Way Comes....

Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelKellough View Post
I'm not worried about your installation but can you imagine the average Joe trying to instal this thing in his shop? Say he had a basement shop with cinder block walls and drilled out and installed lead anchors to hold the bolts.
It goes without saying that I did not take this installation lightly. (It's been a month since I've read this thread, so forgive me if I repeat old information.)

The biggest problem I faced is that I have a beam pocket in the wall where I needed to install the Boom Arm mounting bracket. This makes the wall only 8 inches thick (or 8 inches wide as viewed from the mounting bracket). That would force the concrete anchors too close to the edge, and they would blow out the concrete.

(FYI a concrete anchor in tension will have a conical failure of the concrete. As the embedded anchor pulls on the concrete, it will rupture a cone-shape from the concrete. For this reason, anchors need to be a sufficient distance from any edge, or from another anchor.)

To overcome this problem, I shifted the whole bracket toward the beam pocket so the right-hand anchors were closer to the center of the wall, and the left-hand anchors were floating in air. I then designed a steel bracket that would mount to the other face of the wall (inside the beam pocket) and provide mounting points for these 2 anchors that were free-floating.


Unfortunately, this design (originally) resulted in a new problem, in that 2 of the anchor points came very close to meeting in the middle/interior of the wall. This too could result in a concrete failure if I could not get them separated more.

The top 2 holes shown below were originally almost in-line vertically and almost touching at their ends. This could have resulted in tearing out that entire corner of the wall. I was already at the limit of how far I could shift the main bracket to the right and still get nuts and washers on the 2 floating holes. So the only other choice was to place the 2 side holes as close to the steel support beam as possible.

Unfortunately, if I designed the bracket with these holes too close to the beam, I may not be able to get the hammer drill in close enough to the beam to actually drill the holes. So I decided to drill these first 2 holes before I designed the bracket, and then design the bracket based on the actual hole positions.


Drilling these holes in the concrete first and having a bracket built to fit was a huge risk. If the holes weren't perfect the bracket would have to be scrapped. So I made a wooden mock-up that I could use for accurate measurement and also to give to my fabricator for confirmation of their assembly.



So I dropped off the plans and this mock-up at my fabricator's shop late Thursday afternoon, and to my surprise, I had a completed bracket first thing Friday morning.



I sandblasted the bracket to clean it and hit it with a coat of aircraft primer to protect it.


Oh, I need to back up for a minute. While I was making the wooden template, I discovered that I drilled the first 2 concrete holes so close to the beam's center web that I wouldn't be able to thread a nut on the anchor after they were inserted. Doh! I thought about it for a while and realized that if I threaded the nut all the way on the anchor before I inserted it, it would fit in the gap between the wall and the beam (the beam is about 1" away from the wall).

I was very nervous that this would actually work, and I couldn't mock this up, because once an anchor is inserted in the hole, it cannot be pulled back out. So as soon as the paint was dry, I decided to try to anchor the bracket to the wall with the first 2 anchors, but had planned on finishing the rest on Saturday (today).

Much to my amazement, the installation of these first 2 anchors went without a hitch, and even the nuts didn't pose too much of a problem. With everything going so smoothly, I decided to keep working on installing the bracket (with a few breaks to do the normal office work that I was supposed to be working on).

I started by drilling the bottom-right anchor, and slightly tightening its nut down to hold the bracket in place while I continued to drill the remaining holes. Of course because I hadn't planned on doing this Friday morning, I forgot that I was supposed to plumb the bracket before drilling this first hole. Doh! Thankfully the bracket was out of plumb by only 1/8" and I was able to drive it sideways enough to correct it. (The anchors/studs are 1/2", but the bracket holes are 5/8".)

Starting from the bottom, I drilled each hole, blew out the dust from the hole, inserted the anchor, and lightly snugged the nuts to hold everything in place for the remaining holes. I had borrowed my dad's Bulldog hammer drill, and each hole took only about 1-2 minutes. (Time slows when you're grunting, so who knows, maybe it was only 30 seconds per hole, but felt like an hour.)


I hadn't planned on doing any of this work until Saturday, so I was shocked to have the bracket fully installed shortly after lunch. What the heck, so I called my dad to see if he could help install the boom arm Friday, instead of the previous plan of Saturday. Turns out he was going to be driving past my house in about an hour and could stop in to help.

Wow! That was sooner than I planned, so I quickly scrambled to drill the last hole, re-attach the factory mounting bracket back onto the Boom Arm, and clear the shop of all the clutter that had been gathering in front of the area. As I pondered how we were going to hold up the Boom Arm while I tightened the fasteners, I came to realize one more person sure would come in handy. Normally, two of my neighbors are always home early in the afternoon, but of course, neither one had gotten home yet. I anxiously waited for one of them to come home before my dad showed up.....the cop lost....he came home about 20 minutes before the other neighbor, so he was recruited.

It also blew me away how quickly this final installation went. Less than 15 minutes passed from the time they came down the stairs to evaluate what needed to be done, to the time they left. I had all of my fasteners (nuts for the studs and bolts for the floating anchors) lined up in sequence on the edge of the steel beam. We lifted the Boom Arm onto the lower studs and I quickly threaded on a washer and nut to hold it. Then I installed and tightened the top floating bolt, and worked my way around the bracket with the remaining fasteners as fast as I could so they didn't have to hold the whole weight for very long.

I then switched over to a torque wrench and began torquing the concrete anchors to the prescribed 55 ft-lbs.



It's interesting to see the magnitude of the ASA 5000 compared to the vac-mounted boom arm.





I still need to trim the wall stud a little shorter before I can get the full rotation of the first arm.

Attached Thumbnails
something-wicked-way-comes-mockup.jpg   something-wicked-way-comes-rawbracket.jpg   something-wicked-way-comes-primedbracket.jpg   something-wicked-way-comes-hammerdrill.jpg   something-wicked-way-comes-installed1.jpg  

something-wicked-way-comes-installed2.jpg   something-wicked-way-comes-installed3.jpg   something-wicked-way-comes-installed4.jpg  
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  #105 (permalink)  
Old 05-14-2011, 10:18 PM
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Default Re: Something Wicked This Way Comes....

Nice work Rick - how much weight do you think the arm will hold when fully extended?

neil
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  #106 (permalink)  
Old 05-14-2011, 10:35 PM
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Default Re: Something Wicked This Way Comes....

Quote:
Originally Posted by neilc View Post
Nice work Rick - how much weight do you think the arm will hold when fully extended?
That's a good question, because it really depends on the quality of my concrete wall. The wall was originally designed to support my entire garage floor, so it should be high strength. I'm certainly not willing to test it, but given the margins built-in to the design, I should be able to hang from the arm. However, since failure could possibly knock out that steel I-beam and take down the diagonal corner of my garage floor, I really don't want to put this to the test.
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  #107 (permalink)  
Old 05-15-2011, 03:07 AM
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Default Re: Something Wicked This Way Comes....

As nice as it appears you would really have to question if it's worth the effort for the purpose it serves especially if it's in a shop that's not high production.
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  #108 (permalink)  
Old 05-15-2011, 03:30 AM
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Default Re: Something Wicked This Way Comes....

On the other hand, sometimes just the joy of HAVING a great tool is worth the cost.
Whether that cost is reflected in time or dollars.
Whether the tool is a fine hand plane, a fine power tool, or just an amazingly engineered component.
Whether you need it or whether you don't.
And whether you use it a lot, use it a little, or just look at it.

By that standard, I think it's safe to say Rick's got some pretty good company around here.

Congratulations, Rick. Nice work. It looks awesome.
So.... go make something with it...
... or tie the cats to it...
... or just hang out and admire it...
... whatever floats your boat.

Oh wait. I'M the one with the boat.
(varnish, varnish, varnish...)
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  #109 (permalink)  
Old 05-15-2011, 04:58 AM
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Default Re: Something Wicked This Way Comes....

Quote:
Originally Posted by RONWEN View Post
As nice as it appears you would really have to question if it's worth the effort for the purpose it serves especially if it's in a shop that's not high production.
Ron, you just don't get the whole principle, do you? It has nothing to do with return; just the wow factor.
I admit, this thing certainly brings the concept of overkill to a whole new level.

This afternoon Tanner and I worked on getting the boom arm ready to use. (Which consisted more of head-scratching than anything else.) The first part was easy. The flexible hose at the wall fit directly into the short boom arm hose I already had on my CT22. I picked up a male plug to replace the European 240 volt plug, but more on that part later (I made a last minute design change).

The boom arm is specifically designed to use with the Energy Box, which I don't want to use.

So I needed to remove the aluminum down tube and heavy rubber hose. Much to my surprise, I discovered yesterday that they were riveted together (plus hose clamps). After thinking about it long enough to make sure that I really wanted to remove them both, I drilled out the rivets and removed them.


After removing the rubber hose, I discovered that the fitting was too small for a standard vac hose, so I added a few wraps of cloth friction tape around it and reused the existing hose clamp to secure the vac hose I had on my original boom arm. This is one of the NAINA hoses with the integral plug-it cord running through. Tanner and I just got back from Home Depot with some supplies, so I'll finish describing the plan after I get a few more pictures.
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  #110 (permalink)  
Old 05-15-2011, 06:33 AM
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Default Re: Something Wicked This Way Comes....

I take Laurie & your points. Every now & again the green haze begins to clear from my eyes & I start to get hand holds on the slope. But then I tear loose & again realize it's about the dazzle factor. I'm much better now, thanks for the conciliation. Green Haze be with us all!
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