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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 08-10-2013, 01:02 PM
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Default Re: The table saw dilemma

It's worth remembering that he was making a cross cut (not rip) and just skimming the edge. That maple top was around 30-35mm thick at a guess. Even the ts55 could do that.
Try ripping 50-60mm hard maple in the middle or there abouts of a board. From my experiences with these saws, the result isn't always "gravy" as it was in the video.
My disappointment with the TS saws is in the smart electronics, and how they regulate the speed during cuts in hardwoods. My TS saws just can't keep a consistant speed in thick wood, the motor is jumping around in terms of speed and at times vibrate quite violently.
As always, this is just my honest experience.
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 08-10-2013, 04:54 PM
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Default Re: The table saw dilemma

Hi Okami,

But that's exactly what makes this kind of thread very useful for me! Firsthand feedback and interesting comments...

I think you have listed the only real operation that will be difficult - if though not impossible - without a table saw: ripping in very thick hard wood. Fortunately, the bigger bandsaw will certainly help there, for me.

Other thinks frequently mentionned as tricky without a table saw, like repeatable narrow strips, may be done if the track saw is used with accessories like MFS story stick, Incra LS or parallel guides. But of course, it will be much slower.

- plouf -

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As always, this is just my honest experience.
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 08-10-2013, 05:35 PM
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Default Re: The table saw dilemma

My experience tells me that repeatable narrow strips are much better done on the bandsaw with the jointer. As much as I've tried, I've never had much success ripping narrow strips with the TS55 and guide rails.
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2013, 01:40 AM
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Default Re: The table saw dilemma

Plouf,

Years ago Fine Woodworking magazine had an article where they asked several accomplished woodworkers what machines they would buy in order and why; one responded that he would get the bandsaw and jointer first because you can do both straight and curved work. I've tried to convince friends that want to start woodworking to follow that advice, just because I think someone working without a tablesaw would be more likely to do creative work rather than just straight lines and boxes. Maybe you can be that friend and report back on the type of projects you've made.

-Rutager
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2013, 11:51 AM
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Default Re: The table saw dilemma

Hi Rutager,

It's certainly useful to list here and, even better, document what worked easily or not so easily without a table saw, using the track saw/bandsaw combination.

So I will do it from now on... First next project should be two new hives to replace aging ones.

But at first, just a little disclaimer though :-) You will quickly notice that I'm yet far (read: very far) from the gifted and/or experienced people that haunt this forum.

- plouf -

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Maybe you can be that friend and report back on the type of projects you've made.

-Rutager
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2013, 06:05 PM
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Default Re: The table saw dilemma

Quote:
Originally Posted by Okami View Post
It's worth remembering that he was making a cross cut (not rip) and just skimming the edge. That maple top was around 30-35mm thick at a guess. Even the ts55 could do that.
Try ripping 50-60mm hard maple in the middle or there abouts of a board. From my experiences with these saws, the result isn't always "gravy" as it was in the video.

My disappointment with the TS saws is in the smart electronics, and how they regulate the speed during cuts in hardwoods. My TS saws just can't keep a consistant speed in thick wood, the motor is jumping around in terms of speed and at times vibrate quite violently.
As always, this is just my honest experience.
The vibration has long been my pet peeve with the way the speed control works.

On a table saw to get a very fine cut we adjust feed rate while the blade spins a a constant rate. On every saw blade there is one tooth edge that is a little proud of the others. That tooth is the one that determines the smoothness of the cut. If the work is fed quickly the space between score lines from that tooth is wide enough that we perceive the cut as rougher than when we feed the work slowly and the score lines are closely spaced.

The Festool speed control defeats our attempts to get the smoothest cut because whenever we slow the feed rate the motor slows and the gears grind which causes the blade to vibrate. If the speed control could be bypassed then we could feed slow enough to get the finest score pitch without adding vibration scores.

Lately my old ATF 55 has been acting up, in a good way. Sometimes the speed control does not throttle to speed of the saw. Sometimes on start-up the saw is louder and the speed seems to be 15-20 percent faster and usually that full speed is maintained through the cut. It behaves like an unregulated saw, there is no gear grinding and the only extraneous vibration occurs when the blade encounters a change in the wood like a knot.

This is what I've been wanting for years but I don't know how to get it consistently. Now I have a clue. While looking for a picture of the TS 55 REQ blade housing I found a post Rick made in response to someone whose speed control system failed. I don't have time to investigate now but here is the post.



"The reason why you lost speed control on your...saw is that you lost the feedback loop that tells the controller how fast the motor is turning. The controller thinks the motor is not moving, so it always gives it full power. The hall effect sensor is located in the motor enclosure above the outboard bearing. Either the connector for this sensor is not connected to the controller, or the magnet that this sensor detects has broken."

Seems like the removal of a wire or magnet would by-pass the speed control. The Hall effect sensor loop might be low voltage. It might be possible to add an external switch to turn it on or off.

Last edited by MichaelKellough; 08-13-2013 at 09:48 PM.
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 08-14-2013, 01:57 AM
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Default Re: The table saw dilemma

I'm glad I'm not the only one that's had these frustrations with the festool track saws. I wish the "smart electronics" on my track saws would just stop trying to be so smart..as it seems it's more of a hindrance Reminds me of the brake pad on my before owned rotex
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 02-09-2014, 01:58 AM
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Default Re: The table saw dilemma

I mostly use solid hardwood building furniture and a table saw is my first priority. I have the "Inexpensive Excaliber Sliding Table" but even without that a cross-sled will enable you to cut most things quickly. For breaking down sheets of ply, I use my Porter cable worm drive trim saw and a piece of plywood with a jointed edge. I might consider a track saw if I did kitchen cabinets on a regular basis but, I would not be trying to cut 6/4 or 8/4 stock with a track saw. I have a 20" powermatic band saw and it cuts curves real nicely and does a very decent job of re-sawing but it will never replace my 5hp table saw and I still have all ten fingers without a nick after 35 years.

Cutting thin strips with a table saw is a piece of cake once you use something like the Woodpeckers Table saw alignment gauge to align your blade to the miter slot and your fence to the miter slot. You then use shims to index your cuts for perfect thin strips.

Thanks for reading since I have been overwhelmed at the FOG site for suggesting such a thing. I'm a woodworker first and tool junkie second!

Jack

Last edited by Jacko9; 02-14-2014 at 02:24 AM.
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