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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009, 12:20 PM
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Default Re: Not my jig: Making circles without a lathe

I didn't imagine such a difference in drum tones from different constructions. I was reading on the site that Roger posted:

Re: STAVE v. PLY - What's The Big Deal ???
Quote:
Originally Posted by tcraw1010
Okay, it seems to me that having/making a stave snare is the "flavor of the month" type of thing. My question . . . what is the big deal?
Is there truly a sound difference? Warmth? Fullness? Depth? WHAT IS IT ???

TOM

"Your joking, right? Have you played one? I guess I'm going on 2 years worth of the "Flavor of the Month". You live in SoCal, yeah? Go down to West Coast Drums and see if they have a stave shell (Brady for example) in there & play it. They are all the things you mention and add sensitivity and a more cutting frequency range, depending on woods used. A stave, segment, solid or steam bent single ply will sound much better than a ply drum. I feel you get a much purer tone with thses types of drums. You are dealing with less glue used which in turn allows the shell to vibrate more freely and the different types of woods you can use are limitless. You can really hear a difference in the sound of different woods in these type of shells. They are also visually stunning as I'm sure you have noticed. I mean, a Zebrawood or Macassar Ebony shelled snare just looks awesome compared to a maple plied shell. And they truelly sound amazing! The best sounding snare I own is a Sheoak stave shell Brady. Personally, I'm pretty much over maple ply shelled drums, especially snares."

So, it sounds like stave construction is one of the better ways to go but too much glue affects the sound quality. I think that I read somewhere else on the thread that oak is a popular wood choice?

I don't see myself building drums but the koko jig could be fun for other purposes.
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009, 12:27 PM
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Default Re: Not my jig: Making circles without a lathe

It's definitely not going to bring in the truck loads of cash... but since I am a drummer I enjoy having a different drum to play on for a bit before I go selling it.

There are those that say the glue in a ply shell kills the sound... if that were really the case there wouldn't be so many ply shell kits around. Truthfully they're the best all around since they're lighter, stronger, and still sound great. (Drum building isn't rocket science... we're talking cylinders here...) Yes drums built from solid blocks of wood do have a fuller and richer sound but carrying around a 22" diameter hunk of maple isn't exactly easy. Not to mention staves are a bit more fragile and if you dropped one you'd have a good shot at cracking it. Oak is a very LOUD wood... Plus it's a royal pain in the rear to finish because of the deep grain. Paduak, Mahogany, etc all give me fits because of the amount of grain filling I need to do in order to get a glass like finish.

I didn't really share it here since this is wood working forum... but I built the worlds first Magnesium alloy snare drum. Mostly just to one up some arrogant drum builder bragging about having the lightest shell on earth... lol However it did end up sounding pretty darn good! I actually cut edges into my metal drum shells with a router just like I do the wood ones.
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009, 12:36 PM
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Default Re: Not my jig: Making circles without a lathe

Quote:
Originally Posted by mckenziedrums View Post
It's definitely not going to bring in the truck loads of cash... but since I am a drummer I enjoy having a different drum to play on for a bit before I go selling it.

There are those that say the glue in a ply shell kills the sound... if that were really the case there wouldn't be so many ply shell kits around. Truthfully they're the best all around since they're lighter, stronger, and still sound great. (Drum building isn't rocket science... we're talking cylinders here...) Yes drums built from solid blocks of wood do have a fuller and richer sound but carrying around a 22" diameter hunk of maple isn't exactly easy. Not to mention staves are a bit more fragile and if you dropped one you'd have a good shot at cracking it. Oak is a very LOUD wood... Plus it's a royal pain in the rear to finish because of the deep grain. Paduak, Mahogany, etc all give me fits because of the amount of grain filling I need to do in order to get a glass like finish.

I didn't really share it here since this is wood working forum... but I built the worlds first Magnesium alloy snare drum. Mostly just to one up some arrogant drum builder bragging about having the lightest shell on earth... lol However it did end up sounding pretty darn good! I actually cut edges into my metal drum shells with a router just like I do the wood ones.
I'd like to know more about this. Did you document the construction process?
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Old 07-15-2009, 12:44 PM
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Default Re: Not my jig: Making circles without a lathe

Nothing to document... A slip roll and a good welder is all it takes. Just no one had thought of using the particular alloy I went with. A 14 x 6 metal shell that only weighed 15oz... Lighter than most ply drums in fact. I was able to go down to material that was .057" thick (or is that thin?) and it be strong enough to take the tension of the drum heads. I lovingly refer to her as Maggy and it's probably the one drum I own I will never sell.

For your listening pleasure:

http://mckenziedrums.com/SoundFiles/maggy.mp3
http://mckenziedrums.com/SoundFiles/maggy2.mp3

Pictures of the prototype drum:
http://mckenziedrums.com/Maggy/woodhoops1.jpg
http://mckenziedrums.com/Maggy/maggy2.jpg


Oh and a cherry snare for reference:
http://mckenziedrums.com/SoundFiles/cherrysnare.mp3

Couple of other files in the same directory of various other types of drum shells. It's a different kind of world when you're considering the SOUND of a wood/material rather than the look of the wood. Sometimes both come into play for sure. Zebrawood makes a VERY striking stave drum with the incredible grain pattern all running vertically for instance. Smells awful though
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009, 03:54 PM
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Default Re: Not my jig: Making circles without a lathe

Quote:
Originally Posted by mckenziedrums View Post
Nothing to document... A slip roll and a good welder is all it takes. Just no one had thought of using the particular alloy I went with. A 14 x 6 metal shell that only weighed 15oz... Lighter than most ply drums in fact. I was able to go down to material that was .057" thick (or is that thin?) and it be strong enough to take the tension of the drum heads. I lovingly refer to her as Maggy and it's probably the one drum I own I will never sell.

For your listening pleasure:

http://mckenziedrums.com/SoundFiles/maggy.mp3
http://mckenziedrums.com/SoundFiles/maggy2.mp3

Pictures of the prototype drum:
http://mckenziedrums.com/Maggy/woodhoops1.jpg
http://mckenziedrums.com/Maggy/maggy2.jpg


Oh and a cherry snare for reference:
http://mckenziedrums.com/SoundFiles/cherrysnare.mp3

Couple of other files in the same directory of various other types of drum shells. It's a different kind of world when you're considering the SOUND of a wood/material rather than the look of the wood. Sometimes both come into play for sure. Zebrawood makes a VERY striking stave drum with the incredible grain pattern all running vertically for instance. Smells awful though
That's a little tricky weld job especially to be able to grind the seam to blend flat. What welding process did you use? Welder type?
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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009, 06:01 PM
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Default Re: Not my jig: Making circles without a lathe

Can't say I did it myself... Was going to have them show me how but the shop closed up before I had a chance to visit. For me it was nothing more than researching the materials and giving them the specifications of what I needed. They do make mag welding rod and I'd imagine putting the shell against a curved surface would make it a little more doable. Grinding is the easy part honestly... Just can't be over zealous with removing material. Mag has a very high strength to weight ratio but it's still a soft metal that machines easily.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 07-18-2009, 07:40 AM
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Default Re: Not my jig: Making circles without a lathe

.

Tim,,,,,

FYI, Are you aware of these folks over here near Anaheim (about an hour south of Los Angeles)

They have all sorts of curved plywood and drum stock. If your in Southern California it's a definite destination. I seem to be there every 6 months or so and I am familiar with their stock.
They do mail order and they sell to Die-cut users, the film studio's and people like me.

Worthwhile going over their website.

Curved Plywood, Dieboards, Drumshells Aitwood Home

cheers,
,,,,,,,r

.

Last edited by RogerSavatteri; 07-18-2009 at 07:42 AM.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 07-18-2009, 12:55 PM
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Default Re: Not my jig: Making circles without a lathe

That is one amazing store Roger! I'll bet your imagination & creative juices run wild just walking around inside that place.
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 07-18-2009, 01:22 PM
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Default Re: Not my jig: Making circles without a lathe

Yup... AIT is well known in the drum building world. The drum shells they sell are actually built by Keller. (Keller is the dominate shell maker by far... In fact they used to make shells for DW and still make shells for many popular makes of drums.) Great company to work with if you ever need anything they offer.
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