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  #51 (permalink)  
Old 10-04-2009, 04:42 AM
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Default Re: Waterborne

I too thought it would be a hassle to clean the system out after use but I have found its no big deal at all. The time I save in refilling a small cup and the benefits of an extremely light and manuerverable gun more than make up for it. Even though the fuji system is more expensive than getting the set up I have, I would have to classify it as an amature system in use and results.

OK, once Im done spraying I back flush the lines to put the material back into the pot. That is done by releasing the pressure valve on the pot and then placing a rag on the air cap of the gun and pulling the trigger. The air gets pushed into the fluid line and pushes all the finish back into the pot. Next I empty and rinse the pot and run water thru the line and gun. blow air thru the line and I am done.

As for filtration on the compressor I just have a cheapo filter/water separator. It seems to be working just fine.
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  #52 (permalink)  
Old 10-04-2009, 03:55 PM
Perfect Little Angel
 
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Default Re: Waterborne

Higher pressure at the gun is generally better (at least to a point). The number they give you is not for best spray quality but is required (EPA stuff) to meet a given transfer efficiency. Higher pressure will generally improve atomization of the liquid particles. I spray, adjust, spray and don't worry about the overall number on the gauge but just use it as a starting point.


Quote:
Originally Posted by EijiFuller View Post
the 5psi at the pot is to pressurize the pot so the fluid gets to the gun and out the nozzle (a higher viscosity product will need a higher pressure).

The 25 -30 psi at the gun is the air needed to properly atomize the finish with the wide fan setting. less air is needed to atomize at narrower fan settings.
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  #53 (permalink)  
Old 10-04-2009, 05:44 PM
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Default Re: Waterborne

Quote:
Originally Posted by EijiFuller View Post
I too thought it would be a hassle to clean the system out after use but I have found its no big deal at all. The time I save in refilling a small cup and the benefits of an extremely light and manuerverable gun more than make up for it. Even though the fuji system is more expensive than getting the set up I have, I would have to classify it as an amature system in use and results.

OK, once Im done spraying I back flush the lines to put the material back into the pot. That is done by releasing the pressure valve on the pot and then placing a rag on the air cap of the gun and pulling the trigger. The air gets pushed into the fluid line and pushes all the finish back into the pot. Next I empty and rinse the pot and run water thru the line and gun. blow air thru the line and I am done.

As for filtration on the compressor I just have a cheapo filter/water separator. It seems to be working just fine.
Eiji,

There's no question that pressure pots have lots of benefits (I'm becoming more interested.) But a PPS-based, on-gun, pressure cup has lots of benefits too. My challenge is getting the right balance for me.

Obviously an off-gun pressure pot will be easier to maneuver, lighter in the hand, and you can comfortably use much larger finish cups/pots (which translates to fewer cup/pot refills). OTOH, PPS lets you change finishes more quickly, store multiple finishes and sealers in their PPS liners, and makes cleanup is easier and quicker. It seems like a trade-off.

I think a key deciding factor is how much finish you use per spraying session. This translates to optimum cup/pot size. Using one of your doors as an example... In this portfolio: Entry Door Gallery, take a look at the (lovely) door on the third row, center picture. Roughly how much finish is required per coat for this door? Two quarts (i.e., full pot)? One quart? One pint?

Thanks,

Dan.
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  #54 (permalink)  
Old 10-04-2009, 05:48 PM
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Default Re: Waterborne

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Originally Posted by ChrisM View Post
Higher pressure at the gun is generally better (at least to a point). The number they give you is not for best spray quality but is required (EPA stuff) to meet a given transfer efficiency. Higher pressure will generally improve atomization of the liquid particles. I spray, adjust, spray and don't worry about the overall number on the gauge but just use it as a starting point.
Chris,

What kind of setup do you use? What brand/model of gun and compressor? How do you like your setup?

Thanks,

Dan.
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  #55 (permalink)  
Old 10-04-2009, 10:35 PM
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Default Re: Waterborne

Dan,

For just spraying one door a one quart cup would be just fine. But, I hardley ever just spray one door. Its more like the door, jamb and threshold, trim, a second door if its a double door, and maybe even some sidelites. I can spray out a coat on all of that without refilling. I might even be able to get 2 coats on without refilling. Often the first piece I spray is dry enough to sand and recoat by the time I finish the first coat on the last piece. If I can keep going I can get three coats on in a day and complete a finish job.
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  #56 (permalink)  
Old 10-05-2009, 12:05 AM
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Default Re: Waterborne

Eiji,

Thanks, this gives me info to work with.

Spray Gun World offers a PPS starter kit with a large pressure cup. The large PPS pressure cup holds about .9 quarts. Given your workflow, that's probably not enough. But I think it might be enough for me at least in the short term. Most importantly, it gets me started.

If I find that I need more flexibility, I can add a mid size or mini-cup PPS set up. If I need more volume or need the freedom of a pressure pot setup, I can add a 2-4 quart pressure pot.

Again, many thanks for the great information. To you and the other experienced finishers, some of this may seem obvious. But to a finishing rank beginner (aka "moi"), it's far from that.

Now I'm ready to order - an Asturo 6008WB with the 850ml PPS starter kit. I may need to tweak it a bit as a go along, but this is a GREAT start.

Best regards,

Dan.
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Last edited by DanClark; 10-05-2009 at 04:59 AM. Reason: Changed 5008WB to 6008WB
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  #57 (permalink)  
Old 10-05-2009, 05:51 AM
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Default Re: Waterborne

Quote:
Originally Posted by EijiFuller View Post
I got the Asturo 6008WB pressure feed gun, with 2 quart pressure pot. I love it. Amazing gun and so manuverable compared to the fuji. It lays down a much nicer finish too. I run it off the Thomas T2820 2hp compressor but I think the T200 would easily feed this gun with enough air. I set the compressor to 60 psi at the filter ( a small water seperator) and run a 3/8" x 25' hose to the pressure pot. Pot is set at 5psi and I have a mini regulator at the gun that I set to 20 - 30 depending on the finish.
I got the mini regulator for 30.00 from binks was a piece of #$^$ and had to return it. What a hassle. My only option was to go to harbor freight and pick one up for 6.99 and it works like a champ. Go figure
Eiji,

I'm buying my gun now. I need a filter. Is this the filter you're using: - Harbor Freight Tools - Quality Tools at the Lowest Prices ?

Thanks

Dan.
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  #58 (permalink)  
Old 10-05-2009, 06:04 AM
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Default Re: Waterborne

Dan,

I use a gravity feed HVLP gun from C.A.T. (coating atomization technologies) that they call the Jaguar JSLP. It's a great gun and sprays well, I also use the 3M PPS system on it. I've tried quite a few of them out there. SATA actually makes highest quality guns out there but a gun and extra couple needle nozzle sets will put you back a grand. The C.A.T stuff is nice. They have the best Airless (well sort of) guns on the market. They are pretty innovative, usa made, replacement parts and needle/nozzle sets are affordable and easy to find. You will need more than one needle/nozzle set with any gun you get. Think about getting 3 different sizes to match your coatings. I power mine with a 60 gallon, 5 HP unit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanClark View Post
Chris,

What kind of setup do you use? What brand/model of gun and compressor? How do you like your setup?

Thanks,

Dan.
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  #59 (permalink)  
Old 10-05-2009, 06:45 AM
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Default Re: Waterborne

Chris,

Those CAT guns look very nice, but probably a little too much for me right now. I suspect that my little compressor isn't up to a gun like that.

I just ordered the same gun that Eiji has with a PPS starter kit. It will help me get my feet wet (so to speak) and learn. From there who knows?

Thanks,

Dan.
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  #60 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2010, 11:23 AM
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Default Re: Waterborne

Quote:
Originally Posted by EijiFuller View Post
I picked up some Valspar Zenith pre-cat laquer and gave it a go. This stuff is awesome. It sprays like a dream, dries superfast, and powders up nicely after 20 mins. It also has a really nice warmth almost like a solvent based finish. And you can spray it over an oil based stain with out having to spray shellac first.

I have to say I have been bummed about getting into spraying so far but now I am happy. I didnt know it could be so easy to get a good finish.
I'd like to try the Valspar pre-cat lacquer but I can't find it locally -- does anyone know of a good place to get it on the internet?
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